A Conversation with Cheree Thomas About Cultural Humility

Chéree Thomas is the co-owner and lead trainer for Insight Associates, LLC. She is also the Associate Director of the Michigan Coalition to End Domestic and Sexual Violence. She is a graduate of the University of Toledo where she earned a Masters in Liberal Studies with a concentration in Diversity and Multicultural Studies, and a Bachelors in Liberal Studies with a concentration in Women and Disability. She has served as Executive Director, Program Manager and Senior Director of Programs for several non-profits.

Chéree provides consultation and training to non-profits that are working toward equity for their organizations. She provides training and organization assistance to nonprofits. Chéree is a facilitator and moderator on topics of diversity and inclusion, anti-racism, and intersectionality.

She authored a book, “See Me for Who I Am” that addresses sexual assault issues faced by African American women. Chéree served as board chair for the Society for History and Racial Equity SHARE) and was featured in an exhibit at the Kalamazoo Valley Museum called, “Voices for Social Justice.” She is a member of the Kalamazoo Truth, Racial Healing and Transformation team as a racial healing practitioner. Chéree is also a doula for Rootead, assuring equity in birth outcomes in the Kalamazoo Community.  

The following interview is focused on a presentation that Cheree gave in November 2020 as part of SHARE's Healing Racism Summit.

 

Towards the beginning of your Cultural Humility session, you mentioned that culture is fluid and changing. How does this basic idea contribute to cultural humility?

When you can recognize that culture is ever-changing, there is a greater chance that you can accept that there is absolutely no way you can know all there is about a person and their relationship to their culture. While there are elements of culture that may be shared, there are others that hold no meaning for members of that same culture. Acceptance of this will create space for you to receive another person’s truth as their truth, instead of trying to find someone else from that culture to validate your belief about their culture.

 

You mentioned that there’s a need for those in power to acknowledge what was done to marginalized groups, and to acknowledge that those in power may have benefitted from this system. Why is there reluctance to take this step?

I would say the reluctance stems from not wanting to go beyond that acknowledgment to action steps. A true acknowledgment would also mean that those harmed will need to be made whole. Systems could no longer operate in the way that they do today, as they are currently causing harm to some while creating advantages for others.

 

I appreciated that you made the point that pieces of information were deliberately withheld by those in power, in order to perpetuate bias. In your experience, how can this be corrected?

We need an overhaul of our education system. If we are going to learn about the Indigenous/1^st Nation then we need to learn about them from their voice. A story about slavery is much different coming from those who were enslaved versus the slaveholders.

You went on to talk about the “myth of peaceful protest,” saying that all protest is messy, partly because creativity itself is messy. Especially this year, in light of the protests around the issue of social justice/Black Lives Matter, it seems like there’s a similarity between the distinction made between ‘peaceful’ (i.e. legitimate) and ‘unruly’ (i.e. illegitimate) protests and ‘deserving’ and ‘undeserving’ poor. What do you think?

There is definitely a correlation. It is about who is holding the power and again, who is shaping the narrative. The protests that occurred in 2020 across the nation around social justice/Black Lives Matter was overwhelming people of color. Although the protestors were diverse, the image of groups of people of color throughout history has been seen as a negative.  There is an aversion to wanting to see the most disenfranchised and marginalized in our society speaking their truth. Too often we see an effort to quickly quiet them and move them out of sight. When the truth is contrary to what we have known as the truth, sure it is hard to digest, yet it is still the truth. Telling people of color to be quiet about their pain, or to express it in a way that is more palatable is not only harmful but an exercise of privilege.

 

You had some great thoughts during your presentation. I’d like to pick a few and then ask you to comment. Starting with: “Surround yourself with people who are interested in change.”

Have you ever had a conversation with someone who could not be moved? It is aggravating to say the least. If you desire to be a person who is working toward a just and equitable society, then in order for you to be supported in your movement and growth, those around you have to be interested as well. Change is inevitable. If those in your circle are not interested in change, it will stifle your growth and movement.

 

You also noted: “It’s not enough not to be a racist. You need to be anti-racist.” Can you explain why?

To claim not being racist is only a statement. It doesn’t require action on a person’s part. If you are anti-racist, you are actively engaged in not participating in and disavowing racist behaviors, but also uprooting racism in the systems you are a part of.

And this thought: “Racism is not an other-person issue, only for people who are affected by it. Racism is harmful to everyone.” In your experience, what readily comes to mind when discussing this topic?

The notion that racism is an issue for those who are experiencing racism to heal from and those who are perpetuating racism to end it. Not only is it not true, it gives an out to those who are not experiencing racism and to those who don’t see themselves as racist to not move into action. We all are impacted by racism. And there is a greater responsibility on those who benefit from racism to end it. 

Towards the end of your session, you mentioned a few tips for becoming more culturally humble, like looking within your own community for groups that are engaging marginalized people/groups; recognizing that people are multi-dimensional,a and be willing to be vulnerable. Would you like to expand a bit on any of these?

In many of our communities, there are opportunities to engage with people/cultures other than our own. Efforts to understand another’s perspective or way of life through direct connection can shift perspective for the goods. It allows you to see and know more than what any type of media can give you. It allows you to see the uniqueness of all of us. Being vulnerable in this regard means sharing in a way in which you had never shared before. Being willing to be the “minority” in a space to learn.

Is there anything else you’d like to say?

We have an opportunity in 2021 to work toward equity in a way that we hadn’t before. It is clear that this country is divided. We have to decide, and we can, that hate is no longer accepted in workplaces, in schools, in public gatherings. We have to not just say that Black Lives Matter, we have to create a society that demonstrates this. In 2021 we need to begin overhauling and dismantling systems of oppression. Without excuses.